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TOPIC: How to record activity now UJM is closing

How to record activity now UJM is closing 17 Jun 2018 20:03 #8751

  • Benefit Bolshie
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10 jobs applied for in one day, impressive. Don't do that many in 2 weeks.

Obviously you spent a couple of hours on each, researching the job and the employer and tweaking your CV and profile to suit the position.

You must be worn out. Hope your coach will be suitably impressed.
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 17 Jun 2018 23:15 #8753

archangel wrote:
It's quite easy to apply for 100 jobs after 2 weeks. I applied for 10 today using CV Library's one click application button. It took 2 seconds to make one application. Mind you I know i won't get the jobs so it's all just to keep the jobcentre happy.

All very well but that can go against you. Has your work coach advised (or like some try to do, demand) how many jobs you need to apply for a day? The more vindictive roach can always say "with all these jobs applied how come you're not getting any interviews?" or "you must be doing something wrong if you're getting no results with so many job applications".
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 00:33 #8755

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Personaly i only provide them with the form they give me for recording my job search evidence i belive its known as an ES4 (dont quote me on that ) i have had a few work coaches ask that i provide print outs and every one of them has regreted it coz im a nasty basterd to them about it I chalange them and back them in to a corrner as they sputter inappropriate responces that dont justify there unreasonable demands

firstly i establish that i do have aditional evidence in the form of screenshots saved both on my phone and on my personal computer at home but i firmly state that i will not be provideing that evidance to them as i feel like demanding acses to my phone is an invasion of privacy nor will i provide print outs as i refuse to bear the burden of the cost to make them happy when there is no requierment in law that i do so

I tell them that i record this evidence for my own personal records as well as a defence against any atempt to unlawfully sanction me with vauge acusations and asumtions that i am not looking for work based on no real evidence on there part. I tell them that if they wish me to provide that evidence they will have to make an acusation that falls in line with the DWP guidance on sanctions in these matters.

I allso asert my right to provide my job search evidance in the manner i see fit acording to DWP policy i state i am free to present my job search evidence writen verbaly or otherwise. Furthermore Corroboration should only be necessary if the evidence provided is improbable or self -contradictory.

I then run off a list of questions designed to put them on the spot and back them in to a corner some of them as follows.

1. why do they feel the need to ask for aditional evidence above and beyond that witch all my previous work coachs have requierd and been satisfied with.

2. why do they feel that the standerd ES4 forum provided to record my job search evidence is not good enough for them and if it is not good enough why do they even bother to provide it to claimants in the first place.

3. just what is it about my writen evidence it is they belive to be improbable or self -contradictory.

most of the time they dont even get on to answering querstions 2-3 coz i shut them down to there reply to the first question. Responces i have had are things like oh you have been claiming JSA for over 2 years now and i think a closer look at your evidence would allow me to help you better at witch point i remind them that there are many citizens out there who are long term unemployed through no fault of there own and this alone dose not invalidate my job search evidance or constitute a reason for asking for aditional evidence I allso tell them that i think there idea of helping me is to help me right in to a sanction and i tell them that i will not be provideing the ammunition for them to do so

by this point they are usualy so shocked at my agressive attitude towards them they back down and give up and they tell me things like i have a realy bad attitude and that i should rethink they way i interact with them my reply to this is to tell them if they want to have a more friendly working relationship with me they should adjust there attitudes and stop trying to police me in such an inapropriate manner and fishing for ways to sanction me or bully me in to voulentery courses and unpaid positions

As i said im absolutely nasty to them all the while im giveing them the stink eye and the tone of my voice conveys nothing but contempt but i am calm enough and not swearing or allowing myselff to be agitated enough to cause concern.

I know most of you will think im insane and playing a dangerous game with them but i promised myselff a while back im not gona take anymore shit from them and this is they way i have decided to go about it and so far its been working for me most of the roaches in that office visably sigh when they see its me they have to deal with and they no longer give me shit anymore i get quick signings and out the door in 5 mins most times :P

p.s sorry for my piss poor spelling/grammer but as some of you know i have learning dificulties and cant seem to get spellckeck working on firefox since the update.
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 00:58 #8756

Plenty of good points there, TheFinnster, and as long as you stay calm and assertive you can break down most work roaches into giving you a much easier time. I had the same work roach for several months where I am now, and I'm sure she would have been fine in me offering verbal evidence of job searches (she very rarely looked at my jobsearch evidence on UJM), but I believe she won't be returning. So, next appointment I shall provide the screenshots of my email responses to jobs applied for, then tell this roach that in future I will provide it verbally. If she isn't happy with that we can discuss JSA regulations and the part that states verbal evidence is more than acceptable, and I can provide evidence of jobs applied for to the decision maker should she wish to put a doubt on my claim.
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 01:30 #8757

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Id mebey give that idea some more thought Tarquin its something i have considered in the past when i had a much nicer work coach and while im sure he would have been more than willing to accept verbal evidence my concern was firstly that i think i would struggle to recite everything from memory and secondly you never know when your regular work coach is off sick and you end up having to sign on with someone else who may not be as forgiving
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 10:50 #8770

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Benefit Bolshie wrote:
10 jobs applied for in one day, impressive. Don't do that many in 2 weeks.

Obviously you spent a couple of hours on each, researching the job and the employer and tweaking your CV and profile to suit the position.

You must be worn out. Hope your coach will be suitably impressed.

No I just click on things to get the numbers up. work coach doesn't mind. and hasn't raised any eyebrows yet. give a dog a bone is what i do.
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 10:51 #8772

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Tarquin_Flotsam wrote:
archangel wrote:
It's quite easy to apply for 100 jobs after 2 weeks. I applied for 10 today using CV Library's one click application button. It took 2 seconds to make one application. Mind you I know i won't get the jobs so it's all just to keep the jobcentre happy.

All very well but that can go against you. Has your work coach advised (or like some try to do, demand) how many jobs you need to apply for a day? The more vindictive roach can always say "with all these jobs applied how come you're not getting any interviews?" or "you must be doing something wrong if you're getting no results with so many job applications".

Work coach says i am doing very well and says he wishes more where like me. he is a moron though, and i just give him what he expects.
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 12:28 #8776

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archangel wrote: Mind you I know i won't get the jobs so it's all just to keep the jobcentre happy.

This is my main argument when applying for jobs. We should be able (allowed) to apply for jobs we can do, but we should also be able to apply for GOOD jobs and take that quality time and effort to apply for the jobs we feel should get our best attention and not just fill the gaps with other jobs we know we are using to maintain the timesheets work coaches like to see. I personally feel this is one area I would be standing my ground on because there must be times when there are no jobs advertised in that week that match what we really want to be doing, yet there is that warped mindset that we must apply for 20 jobs in a week? Sod that (as Tarquin would say! :P )

Quality over quantity will always win any argument and those words `doing all we REASONABLY can` to find work. The Secretary of State`s words, not mine. So don`t panic people. Fulfill what`s agreed to on your CC and at the same time, don`t agree to Unreasonable demands you know you can`t achieve.
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 13:24 #8779

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"Demand how many jobs you need to apply for a day?" In their dreams :cheer:


61. Claimants should not be set a minimum number of jobs to apply for each week as such a requirement is unenforceable. If a claimant is unable to find enough jobs to apply for this may be through no fault of their job-search, whilst if a claimant were to find more than the minimum number, specifying a lower number to apply for is actually unhelpful. It is reasonable to state ‘I will apply for all jobs that I find that I am capable of doing.’ :)

I believe this will cover days as well although the numb skulls may like to argue that, and if so, they can then show us all the legislation that specifies that little 'idea' :)
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 13:37 #8780

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Where did you find that snippet from jobber? I`ve probably got it saved somewhere within the depths of a longer website page but wondered if it was one you had a link to so I can compare if I have it? These are the regulations we should actually be siting to work coaches when asked about anything relating to our jobsearch if ever faced with such contempt.
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 13:47 #8783

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Claimant Commitment
Guidance Queries and Help
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 14:11 #8785

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Claimant Commitment
Guidance Queries and Help


www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/250147/response/611633/attach/5/Claimant%20Commitment%20Guidance.pdf

61. Claimants should not be set a minimum number of jobs to apply for each week as such a requirement is unenforceable. If a claimant is unable to find enough jobs to apply for this may be through no fault of their jobsearch, whilst if a claimant were to find more than the minimum number, specifying a lower number to apply for is actually unhelpful. It is reasonable to state ‘I will apply for all jobs that I find that I am capable of doing’
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 18 Jun 2018 15:01 #8787

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Thanks muchly guys. Didn`t have this one saved but have now. B)
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 19 Jun 2018 12:15 #8808

Well, worst case scenario today when signing on. I switched on the printer to print up my 2 pages to show as job search activity to the work roach and... it's run out of black ink too! Great timing...! So, I put my screenshots onto my memory stick (yes I know they don't allow memory/flash sticks on JCP computers but I took it anyway) and set off for my appointment.

My appointment was first thing this morning, 8.30. The roach was late, didn't see her untl 8:45. But, this gave me time to listen in to a conversation between another claimant and his roach. He seemed confused as all his jobsearch activity on UJM had disappeared (the site finally shut down late last night) and he hadn't saved it anywhere else. His roach said he should have registered with FaJ once he was aware of UJM's closure and transferred all his activity to there. Well, that was bullcrap because of course you can't manually add stuff on to FaJ. Then the conversation got interesting... She said to him, "We can register you with FaJ now if you want from my computer, and share the password so I can see your activity on the site." He just nodded his head and said that was fine... Mind boggling! Unfortunately I was then called to my appointment so missed the rest of their chat.

I gave my (temporary) roach my jobsearch activity verbally. I didn't go into great detail, just explained the kind of work I was applying for and what sites I was applying on, and had email confirmation for most of these. I told her I had screenshots of these emails on my memory stick, making out I didn't know they wouldn't allow this at the jobcentre, as evidence should their be any doubt cast on my verbal evidence. She mentioned FaJ briefly, I told her I registered with the site, but it's vastly inferior to Indeed, CV-Library, Reed & TotalJobs.com so don't use it. Brief pause from her, then she said "OK, let's sign you on, that's fine", and I was out of there!

But there could be trouble ahead... my usual work roach is still off "sick", so my next appointment I was booked with another roach who I know is trouble as I had a few run-ins with her at my previous jobcentre. I doubt things will go so smoothly if I offer her verbal evidence, but we shall see...
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 19 Jun 2018 12:50 #8809

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So if wc are wanting password to faj and claimants who don't dispute anything and go along with what wc says. This will mean those of us who do not give wc password/assess will be in for a battle/argument/interrogation.

They don't treat anyone individually, they expect everyone to just use faj and no other site.
Faj is rubbish like ujm you don't even get a response when applying for a job on it.
Also how can these work coaches still be playing dumb, when we know you can't manually add anything to your account.
Not that it would mean anything if you could as wc would be moaning about something else if you did everything they wanted.
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 21 Jun 2018 08:27 #8861

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Do not worry Catwoman as they cannot ask for password to any website you have signed up for.

Although the snip below was taken from an FOI regarding UJM i put money on it will be exactly the same stance if another FOI was put in asking the same question.

Not 100% but think someone has already done an FOI on this little topic maybe Frank Zola whos posted some excellent stuff regards to find a joke :) .

"Last time I was in the Jobcentre I was told that I had to give the Jobcentre access to
my Universal Jobsmatch account by ticking the box, online, which reads "I authorise
DWP Work Coaches to view my account, including job search activity, feedback and
notes" otherwise I could be sanctioned or get in trouble in some other way. Is this
true? Do I risk getting in trouble if I do not comply? "

You also cannot issue a Jobseeker’s Direction to mandate a claimant to give us
access to their account – this is their decision not ours
.”

welfarecentral.org/index.php/forum-home/find-a-job-service/1731-dwp-minister-find-a-job-website-not-compulsory-for-jsa-or-uc-claimants

dwpexamination.org/forum/newsreel/official-universal-jobmatch-to-be-abolished-may-14th-2018-but/

If you want to put your paws down with them Catwoman :cheer: build a list of 4 -6 other websites that you like /willing to use and stick to those saying they are more suitable for you. :) If they are disregarding what you say Catwoman show them any FOI's you may have, send them all to joke shop manager and copies to your MP and see them change tact,they cannot disregard FOI requests in replies to their own stupid half wit regulations etc. :angry:

DWP:

"DWP staff will not have access to view jobseeker accounts, CVs or
activity/application history.”
www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/479339/response/1158772/attach/html/3/Reply%202046.pdf.html
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 21 Jun 2018 08:52 #8863

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Tarquin_Flotsam wrote:
My appointment was first thing this morning, 8.30. The roach was late, didn't see her untl 8:45. But, this gave me time to listen in to a conversation between another claimant and his roach. He seemed confused as all his jobsearch activity on UJM had disappeared (the site finally shut down late last night) and he hadn't saved it anywhere else. His roach said he should have registered with FaJ once he was aware of UJM's closure and transferred all his activity to there. Well, that was bullcrap because of course you can't manually add stuff on to FaJ. Then the conversation got interesting... She said to him, "We can register you with FaJ now if you want from my computer, and share the password so I can see your activity on the site." He just nodded his head and said that was fine... Mind boggling! Unfortunately I was then called to my appointment so missed the rest of their chat.
.

Its Obvious to me far to many people don't have a clue about their Rights, The Law, Or how the DWP is NOT there to help us in any way, shape or form.
What so many urgently need is forums such as this one, Come on spread the word, If you can print out cards/leaflets perhaps you can get Free use of Job Centre facilities. :whistle:
YNWA: You'll Never Walk Alone
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 21 Jun 2018 09:08 #8864

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If those plebs at joke shop smell fear, or pick up on certain individuals who may not be too clued up on their rights they go in for the kill.

Its been my experience current and past when dealing with joke shop, their game is of trying to beat people into submission to comply with their delusional bureaucratic way of thinking fed to them by their paymasters down at the SSP club :evil:

Thanks to websites like this, and the well informed members on here, we can all give jc/dwp hell as best as we can :)



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How to record activity now UJM is closing 26 Jun 2018 11:25 #8969

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Hello Catwoman,

Did you log your complaint about that scumbag provider company,if so can you update us all on how this is proceeding if possible ?

jobber
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How to record activity now UJM is closing 26 Jun 2018 11:52 #8971

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Tarquin_Flotsam wrote:
If she isn't happy with that we can discuss JSA regulations and the part that states verbal evidence is more than acceptable

Have you got a link to the document that says this?
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