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TOPIC: universal credit online service

universal credit online service 26 Jun 2018 17:55 #8995

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Thanks blackbeard for this input. The first thing that sprung to mind was, what happens when our computer dies a death or our broadband conks out for a week and we have to trek to a library or other such place to access our UC account/journal? It`s pretty obvious that this ONLINE system is just that and we are truly stuffed should any of the aforementioned happen. We can always call the UC helpline to inform them of any problems (if they bother to answer the phone within 40 minutes) but this all sounds to me like an accident waiting to happen. Talk about shredding the nerves..... :S
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universal credit online service 26 Jun 2018 22:34 #8998

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What happens if you rely on the library for jobsearch.
If you check your todo list in the morning, the wc might message you in the afternoon.
Sounds like they want everyone glued to the internet all day.
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universal credit online service 27 Jun 2018 01:21 #8999

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Blackbeard, Time for a bit of a reality check here:

[1] Wed 20 June at 10.59
You started this thread with a post about a letter you got on Tues 19th June telling you that you need to switch to the new Universal Credit Online Service within a week or face losing your benefits or having your claim stopped.

For those threats to have any validity you would either have to have been in receipt of benefits or started the process of making a claim for benefits when that letter was written. Right?


[2] Wed 20 June at 18.03
You added a second post describing your first day at what turned out to be a non-job. You say this was Monday. Would that be Monday 18th June, two days before starting this thread?

In order to get the letter on the Tuesday 19th it would have had to be written out and posted on Mon 18th, the same day as you were supposed to be starting your new job. Right?

Would it be reasonable to assume that you turned down the job offer and was actually unemployed when you left that employer’s premises on that Monday?

You had previously stated that your work coach was not aware of your prospective job starting on that Monday because you didn’t mention it to him.

So, to all intents and purposes, as far as you were concerned and as far as JCP and your benefit claim was concerned, your circumstances had not changed. Right?

You suspect that the company must have contacted the Jobcentre on the Monday soon after you turned down the position offered with their version of events. That’s unlikely since you didn’t apply via JCP and the Data Protection Act forbids such contact.

Did you contact JCP on that Monday?


[3] Thurs 21 June 11.00
You contacted the number on the letter (not your local JCP) I think this will turn out to have been a big mistake.

If the letter you got on 19th June was dated two weeks previously then there is no way it could be legitimately linked to the non-job issue at this stage. Right?


[4] Fri 22nd June 00.31
It seems you went along with what was proposed to you on Thurs 21st June without contacting your own work coach.

You have now actively changed your own circumstances without informing your work coach as the law requires. The result of this is a loss of benefits, termination of claim. That’s the law.


[5] Fri 22nd June 16.38
You continue that day with your online claim despite the fact that you already had an active claim ongoing, since at this stage there was no notification given by you to your work coach of a change of circumstances, therefore nothing amiss with your existing claim.

Not sure what you’re saying here, that you phoned UC to fix up appointments at your local JCP?

Anyway another chance to contact your own coach missed. What better proof of identity do you think you need than a coach who knows you through dealing with you and who knows you have an active ongoing claim?


[6] Tues 26th June 16.28
You give an account of a meeting with your coach the day before who doesn’t appear to be aware of what version of UC you are supposed to be on.

Sounds like he and the manager are under the impression that you have filed for a new claim because of a change of circumstances, which is the only legitimate way you could do it. Somewhere along the line both your contact who sent you the original letter and now the staff of your local JCP are under the impression that your circumstances have changed and that they are now obliged to act accordingly, which means, to all intents and purposes starting a new claim with all that that entails.

You have not said what the situation is now, if you are now on the new online UC or not yet. You never even mentioned about a new CC.

No mention by anyone about the non-job. and no mention of what the change of circumstances were supposed to be that initiated the making of a new claim. Did you get a written statement setting out what that change was supposed to be?

Do you need to attend another interview where there may be a chance of repairing some of the damage done?
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universal credit online service 27 Jun 2018 11:56 #9009

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Blackbeard, Time for a bit of a reality check here:
first off i dont need a reality check BB
i post on this website etc to help people and also ask for help when i dont understand something
i dont come on here to have a columbo style quiz from you
for all i know you could be working for DWP who knows

i have nothing to hide
the dates.days i put may not be 100%
reason why i will tell you
if i go to my local roach center on a monday as example i may write on here i went on the tue
]reason being i dont want to be identified by the roach center yes you may say its paranoia etc but i have heard roachs in past saying they look online at peoples facebook etc writing stuff online etc may be all hearsay but who knows
i am wary so the dates/days may look odd but everything i write is correct better things to do then spend my time making things up.


( .1] Wed 20 June at 10.59
You started this thread with a post about a letter you got on Tues 19th June telling you that you need to switch to the new Universal Credit Online Service within a week or face losing your benefits or having your claim stopped.)

For those threats to have any validity you would either have to have been in receipt of benefits or started the process of making a claim for benefits when that letter was written. Right?

Yes i was on universal credit the old version like i did say and when i got to roach center the letter was overdue by 3 or 4 days i should of signed up to the new service sooner but they dint moan etc as i spoke on the phone with UC and said well i only got it yesterday etc can you add a note to system.

2] Wed 20 June at 18.03
You added a second post describing your first day at what turned out to be a non-job. You say this was Monday. Would that be Monday 18th June, two days before starting this thread?

like i said i dont always put the correct day do you think people would come on here ask for advice etc then make crap up.


(Would it be reasonable to assume that you turned down the job offer and was actually unemployed when you left that employer’s premises on that Monday?
You had previously stated that your work coach was not aware of your prospective job starting on that Monday because you didn’t mention it to him.)

well ther was not job offer so how could i turn it down and yes i am unemployed
and also as you know they cant make you accept zero hours jobs or if they are over certain distance 70 miles etc.

yes they was aware i had interview but i did not tell them about
what the company said on the phone as i wanted to make sure i got a job before phoneing DWP
as i did explain try reading my post properley
i did not have any detail about the job role as i did not get the admin one but the company said they may have something for me to do and to come in when HR contact me and meet contact on site for induction and more details.


3] Thurs 21 June 11.00
You contacted the number on the letter (not your local JCP) I think this will turn out to have been a big mistake.

(you cant contact the local JCP if you get a UC letter i have in past and they tell you to contact the UC phone line.)

If the letter you got on 19th June was dated two weeks previously then there is no way it could be legitimately linked to the non-job issue at this stage. Right?

(well i only found about letter once i phoned them that any one on UC will be moving over to the online service some people are moving over now and some in future i did not know that then until i asked UC on phone and also asked at roach center.)



([4] Fri 22nd June 00.31
It seems you went along with what was proposed to you on Thurs 21st June without contacting your own work coach.)

clearly your not on UC BB are you
when you contact roach local they tell you to phone the number on letter as they cant get full details on pc only head office.


(You have now actively changed your own circumstances without informing your work coach as the law requires. The result of this is a loss of benefits, termination of claim. That’s the law.)

how have i changed anything i done what they told me to do on the letter
after phoning them and confirming its correct
and was clearly told i must follow what it says on the letter and sign up for the new online service
that was after they got up my details on computer etc on the phone
so i would say they know more about my details then you do woundant you say
and i do know employment law as i was a union rep many years ago.



(Not sure what you’re saying here, that you phoned UC to fix up appointments at your local JCP?
Anyway another chance to contact your own coach missed. What better proof of identity do you think you need than a coach who knows you through dealing with you and who knows you have an active ongoing claim?)

what better proof so lets say you go aboard every week and people reconise you dos that mean you dont need a passport?
you need photo ID for everything these days even buying beer in a asda.

([6] Tues 26th June 16.28
You give an account of a meeting with your coach the day before who doesn’t appear to be aware of what version of UC you are supposed to be on.)

no they was not aware as i said its the new UC online live service
but they sorted then for me.

(You have not said what the situation is now, if you are now on the new online UC or not yet. You never even mentioned about a new CC.)

?how have i not said my situation i am on the new online service my new CC
is same as UC old version CC apply for jobs contact agency upload my CV etc on the new site with the journal.


No mention by anyone about the non-job. and no mention of what the change of circumstances were supposed to be that initiated the making of a new claim. Did you get a written statement setting out what that change was supposed to be?

well like i said in my other post i got the manager in the office said ther is not a job here for me if it means traveling to runcorn etc on min wage
useing my car petrol and with no job description means no role/job to me.

(what that change was supposed to be?)

like i said the roach told me moving on to the live service new UC
is classed as a change of circumstance on ther computers a its moveing on to the new service.

and 1 final note BB
if you dont beleave what i write on here
kindly dont read it then. :) as i dont want to keep explain to you better things to do with my time
like looking for a job
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universal credit online service 27 Jun 2018 12:48 #9010

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What I`m wondering is, when someone already claims this (old style UC) and is already ON the UC system, why the need to do a fresh claim like this? Seems a bit crazy when someone has already done all the verify stuff? Shouldn`t they just be `updating` someone`s claim and just going over the usual clarifications when they next see their work coach or the letter could say "We will soon be moving you over to the new online service" and ask that we bring some necessary documents to do a double check for this to be done? Seems they will never be satisfied until we are all verified and tied to a robotic system that controls our every move.

blackbeard, well done for getting through all their nonsense. I would have been inclined to call my work coach as well but as you said, chances are they would have told me to call the UC number on the letter because I doubt work coaches can deal with such matters until the claimant has acted upon them.
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universal credit online service 27 Jun 2018 14:05 #9011

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( why the need to do a fresh claim like this? Seems a bit crazy when someone has already done all the verify stuff?)

i asked same thing at roach center cant you just transfer my details etc rather then doing the whole verify thing
told me its to update the system with new details in other words he dint have a clue

roach at roach center said my normal work roach i normally see when i sign on
will change as she is on the old UC (group coachs)
where as the new roach is on the new (UC online group coachs with journal etc )

my opinion and its only a opinion dont want Colombo
quizzing me

i think they want everything online so they can monitor
the claimant easily what time you log in etc
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universal credit online service 27 Jun 2018 14:06 #9012

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When I said time for a reality check I meant for the various Jobcentre and UC people who don’t appear to know what is going on with your claim and why you are being asked the same things repeatedly despite already being on the benefit. You acknowledged yourself how unnecessary it all appears to be, so, in a way, you are agreeing with me that a bit of reality (on their part) might not go amiss.

Anyway, if you are satisfied with the result of your negotiations over the past week or so then so be it.

My apologies for jumping to the wrong conclusion in thinking that you were wrongly, if not illegally, treated.
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universal credit online service 27 Jun 2018 14:46 #9013

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no need for apologies both of us misunderstood

i dont fully understand this new UC online journal thing etc.

and after my visit to roach center i think half of them roachs dont fully ether
it seems some have had training on it others haven't.
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universal credit online service 27 Jun 2018 17:19 #9014

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I know the coach I see told me at the beginning of this year I might not see her `next time` as she was going to UC. Thankfully it was her I saw, but my gut feeling is that work coaches are being trained up still and trying to understand how this maze of a system works. Lots of work coaches will be seeking help from their colleagues no doubt when they come across IT problems they don`t understand, so some coaches will be able to advise them no doubt as they `train on the job`.

I don`t envy their task one bit, but I`d rather not be on the receiving end either.
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universal credit online service 27 Jun 2018 20:57 #9018

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The two I currently see, have both had the 4 weeks training. Now they do two days JSA and 2 days UC. So hopefully I will still have them when I am eventually migrated over.
Toads - Philip Larkin
Why should I let the toad work, Squat on my life?
Can't I use my wit as a pitchfork And drive the brute off?
Six days of the week it soils,With its sickening poison -
Just for paying a few bills! That's out of proportion...
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universal credit online service 28 Jun 2018 08:54 #9024

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Catwoman wrote:
What happens if you rely on the library for jobsearch.
If you check your todo list in the morning, the wc might message you in the afternoon.
Sounds like they want everyone glued to the internet all day.


Totally agree Cat-woman,they would have us glued to the net all day if they could.
DWP's clowns would have us all sitting in job centres 8 hours a day if they had enough computers just to keep control of everyone.
What they cant get through their thick heads is starring at endless web pages dosent mean it will get anyone a worthwhile job;or any job at all.

If the works there,it there! and if its not it's not! :cheer: :evil:

I feel that all the 'new' WHP will be is just more people sitting in rooms starring at computer screens,trying to pass this off to the tax payer of their new one to one specialist help of getting people into work.
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universal credit online service 28 Jun 2018 09:00 #9025

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"they will tell you what they are doing to change it, " Oh no they dont Spike :) My Roach often slips stuff into my 'CC' after ive signed and gone :evil:It's amazing how they try stupid little tricks to hopefully bring about a sanction situation.
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universal credit online service 28 Jun 2018 09:12 #9027

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Verc wrote:
As for having people doing the UC interrogation in all forms possible this reminds me of enrolling for uni when they had everything quadruplicate and still ballsed it up. And I had to deal with the JC on top as well. It is bureaucracy for the sake of bureaucracy. Once again UC proving not fit for purpose - the purpose being; to make things simpler for benefits claimants, instead they have sucked the low paid into the mire as well. How ministers can still dismiss a UBI which would eliminate the means testing and time consuming side only underlines how it has all been designed to create as much chaos and confusion as possible. As Orwell was basically saying with his ministries in 1984 (ministry of Love which deals in Hate...etc) expect whatever politicians say to mean the opposite of what they really intend.



Hi Verc,

Yes the TORYS if they had a brain cell between them would operate a UBI but as they are so arrogant and bloody minded, they are more content in helping develop an economic climate where businesses have an endless supply of sheep ready to be picked from a herd at anytime, bureaucracy gone MAD!.

What theyve seriously overlooked and i believe one day will filter down and bite them hard is; its all very well having the sheep working for nothing,paying no or nominal amounts of tax but their still claiming benefits even though in part time work and have heard of cases where their fully employed and still having to claim.

Its a false economy and only the 10% club have been benefiting from this since 2008 and not the people on benefits i might add. :)




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universal credit online service 28 Jun 2018 09:29 #9028

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Hi Blackbeard,

Not sure at all about all this as i live in London area and this pile of crap hasn't been even mentioned as yet to me, new UC online service,i dont even use the old one :cheer:

What do we do if we have no passport as i imagine like myself many out there will have one 10 years out of date now due to things being so good with the economic environment :) .


'nope you need to book appointment for that'
Make sure you reclaim or travel exspenses for this Blackbeard as its them asking you to book the appointment and it being outside of the fortnightly joke shop UC visiting time :)


'updating from the old system so need peoples up to date details on the new system'
This sounds to to me like another full blown cock up in that they've not made things within the website fully data protected/compliant etc

'you can book your own job center appointments online aswell'
Very interesting this, we actually can now choose when to see roach,really cant see how this will pan out anyone ?

I think i am being a bit thick here and missing the obvious as haven't received a letter about any new UC sign up etc,been on it for months so will wait.
Having to go through all this crap all over again is going to be a real chore and thats exactly what this is really all about,to ensure to make things as difficult as possible wit their nutty line of'thinking' will make sure we all add the time to our joke search while doing this as they are wasting our time as should be looking for 'work'
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universal credit online service 28 Jun 2018 09:49 #9029

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jobber wrote: I think i am being a bit thick here and missing the obvious as haven't received a letter about any new UC sign up etc,been on it for months so will wait.

It could be something they are just doing automatically jobber and asking claimants to go through all their claim again just to get everyone using the full digital option. Making sure those who are not using this journal are now fully compliant. The letter blackbeard received seemed to suggest if he didn`t carry out this action his UC would be affected. When we receive letters saying that our benefit will stop if we don`t make the changes, that can be enough to motivate people without questioning if the letter is lawful or not. My mother has been asked recently to switch to using her bank account to pay in her pension which will mean her post office account would close. It`s all about saving DWP a few pence each week. We haven't yet acted on this change but will probably end up doing it as the government are mulling over whether to extend the contract with the post office. So it could end up being mandatory anyway.
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universal credit online service 28 Jun 2018 10:09 #9030

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Cheers Comply, reading through what Blackbeard posted filled me with dread as its effectively asking us all to start the whole bloody pathetic process again.

Also .gov nose growing bigger checking peoples bank accounts etc, do these half wits really think if someone was doing anything on the side they'd be putting their cash through a bloody bank account.
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universal credit online service 28 Jun 2018 12:41 #9032

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jobber wrote: its effectively asking us all to start the whole bloody pathetic process again.

Does seem like that jobber. Will be interesting to hear from other members who have been on UC for a while and also receive similar instruction to do the same actions as blackbeard was. If you don`t personally receive a letter like this, might be worth running it past your own work coach next time asking if people already claiming UC from X date will be asked to re-claim? Just say you were speaking to someone who had to do this and had no choice.
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universal credit online service 28 Jun 2018 21:14 #9041

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Was my first thought when i went roach center i said is it just me moveing over to the new online UC because if it is then am i being singled out roach told me no every one will move to the new online service with journal etc just some before others which is still weird.

UC Told me on phone same thing every 1 will get this daft letter when i phoned them and it was like they was trying to sell me a car
Example
o the new service is great and faster etc you can book your own apointments online and speak to your roach online then when i went to joke center i asked and they told me you cant book apointments yourself you can see apointment time day etc but you have no option to book yourself.

They dont know what they are doing
The roach i seen to verfiy my ID etc walked off to see other roach heard him say hes on the.old UC now and hes moveing to the new UC how do i set up his profile on computer he will need a new apoitment for his new CC wont he.

Once they start moveing people over they may sort it and make it easier for people but i wodant hold my breath.
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universal credit online service 29 Jun 2018 08:45 #9043

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This all sounds very randomised at the moment but also worrying. The UC system is all over the place while some work coaches will grasp the concept of it, they can`t always know what`s happening and their colleagues don`t either. It`s like puting a jigsaw together and finding some of the pieces are missing.

In the meantime, claimants are meant to navigate this mess without always fully understanding each part of it and it`s easy to become piggy in the middle. The whole thought of not being able to (or forgetting to) check an online journal or emails for updates sounds to me like a mental health crash for many people, especially those on the edge of not being found to have limited capability for work and are assigned goals to achieve they won`t possibly be able to keep up with on a daily basis.
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universal credit online service 02 Jul 2018 06:37 #9079

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Spike wrote:"This (as far as I know) only goes to your adviser/Job Centre." I'm not so sure about this Spike as i thought joke shop were not allowed to have copies of our CV's ?

There are so many things messed up with this governments waste of bureaucracy /maladministration its like they change the rules daily to suit them, not the individual looking for work.

They may have invented a digital online platform for UC but its a shoddy one as is the whole circus of UC :whistle: :evil: .



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