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TOPIC: DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”?

DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”? 12 Jun 2018 18:54 #8620

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"Find out more about how to manage and delete cookies.
You can still use this service with cookies turned off. "
findajob.dwp.gov.uk/cookies.html#session-and-authentication

Very different from the far more extensive use of cookies on Jobmatch
jobsearch.direct.gov.uk/Account/CookiesAbout.aspx?md=1

My own initial thoughts at
mrfrankzola.wordpress.com/2018/06/12/dwp-says-find-a-job-findajob-dwp-gov-uk-can-be-used-with-cookies-turned-off/
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DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”? 13 Jun 2018 07:35 #8625

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Hi Frank. Just had a quick read through of the link (it`s early so head isn`t on straight!) so am I right in thinking that the FAJ site is saying, someone cannot create an account or upload a CV without first accepting their authenticated cookies? They seem to be saying that the site wouldn`t be able to display or find/match our details otherwise?

Also, will this be the excuse work coaches use for disallowing the use of other jobsites if they think jobseekers are avoiding FAJ? They say in one sentence that FAJ isn`t compulsory, but then say that work coaches may not think other jobsites are relevent to the matching of jobs a claimant may be looking for?

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Once again, they cause doubt in the minds of people who may want to swerve FAJ, although creating a profile on that site and keeping it totally private to our own computer may find some middle ground where a work coach may keep on about FAJ if they know someone is just refusing to go near it for the sake of being difficult, but we know that`s not the case, it`s about freedom of choice.
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DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”? 13 Jun 2018 07:57 #8626

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Hi FrankZola,

This is all good, but are wondering how we do this in local joke shops as in mine; they have done something to the browser config and no way to delete cookies etc or change any other setting in ie.I go in that place to do a "job search" and their stupid donkey speed pc's never working .

I am one of those nice people who wont be using their silly find a joke website but others may feel pressured into doing so; even though this bullying of people is wrong.To appease the morons at joke shop i just use the search function in faj once a week and use ccleaner to deal with all cookies on my PC after.I dont log in and use this website as a rule of thumb so to speak.

Its amazing that after doing 35 hours joke search they then want people to do more while in joke shop :whistle: It's like their pc's are specifically geared to find people 'special types of work :whistle: '
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DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”? 13 Jun 2018 11:07 #8629

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comply or die wrote:
Also, will this be the excuse work coaches use for disallowing the use of other jobsites if they think jobseekers are avoiding FAJ? They say in one sentence that FAJ isn`t compulsory, but then say that work coaches may not think other jobsites are relevent to the matching of jobs a claimant may be looking for?

Once again, they cause doubt in the minds of people who may want to swerve FAJ, although creating a profile on that site and keeping it totally private to our own computer may find some middle ground where a work coach may keep on about FAJ if they know someone is just refusing to go near it for the sake of being difficult, but we know that`s not the case, it`s about freedom of choice.

Looks like they are bending over backwards to find an excuse to get people to use FaJ. Hope they don't ignore what that Work and Pensions minister said about us not having to use FaJ. I don't know what to believe any more. Let's hope Labour gets in in 2020. If not we may have to look for a better country to live in.
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DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”? 13 Jun 2018 13:48 #8632

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archangel wrote: I don't know what to believe any more.

It`s a bit like a ping-pong game. DWP say one thing, work coach tells you something else. We then produce a print out of said document that provides the relevant regulations, work coach tells us we should be looking for a job and not worrying about what MP`s say! At this point, we either stand our ground and press the issue, or wait for a response that will either be in agreement and accepted, or they will put their black cap on and start ranting about giving a direction to do so. Can`t bloody win...
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DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”? 13 Jun 2018 14:43 #8637

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Like someone here said a few months ago its all a clever plan to confuse us and keep us guessing. Either that or they are genuinely idiots who don’t know what they are doing. But I somehow doubt it.
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DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”? 13 Jun 2018 15:27 #8638

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Cookies: subscriber or user?

For Jobmatch and prior to the GDPR and the Data Protection Act (2018) the DWP did mandate creating an account, a profile and uploading a CV for JSA via a Jobseeker Direction (JSD) and they could then only mandate it's use on a Jobcentre computer. Many argued that the DWP needed claimant consent to accept Cookies on ANY computer. However, under the Privacy and Electronic Communications Regulations "consent should be obtained from the subscriber or user" and understand the DWP considered itself to be the "subscriber", (for Jobcentre internet access devices/computers) so claimant consent not needed.

Crux

The crux for claimants is the basis, evidence and process a 'coach' follows to deem another Jobsite is "suitable" or not and records they keep of such.

Suitable?


Which of the following Jobsites is most "suitable"?

"1,146,660Jobs in UK" on www.adzuna.co.uk/jobs/uk

"165,976 Jobs in UK" on findajob.dwp.gov.uk/search?q=&w=


Review

The claimant always has the right to request a review when a 'coach' suggests adding FAJ to a JSA/CC (variation) and the 'coach' does not consider the claimants alternative jobsite(s) are more appropriate or "suitable"

"Whether Indeed or Total Jobs are appropriate websites will depend on the
type of work each claimant is looking for and the vacancies displayed on
those sites.” FOI 2388 reply of 4 June 2018

Standard JSA Claimant Commitment

"My rights
I know if there is a disagreement about my Claimant Commitment, I can ask for this to be reviewed...."
www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/405670/response/980045/attach/html/4/CC%20O18%20E15.pdf.html
Discussed at welfarecentral.org/index.php/forum-home/benefits-discussion/1720-should-you-renegotiate-your-cc-when-faj-comes-in?start=40#8527

"If a claimant creates an account using a jobsite other than Find a job, it must be one that is deemed to be suitable by the Work Coach.”"
"deemed"? How, criteria and on what basis?
"deemed" ‘act as judge’?
"unfettered discretion"? Not!
welfarecentral.org/index.php/forum-home/benefits-discussion/1720-should-you-renegotiate-your-cc-when-faj-comes-in?start=40#8542

I do not know the current status of cookies and FAJ, but ICO can be asked. Except for these thoughts.
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DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”? 13 Jun 2018 16:25 #8640

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I`ve always argued (with myself!) that quality is better than quantity, so just taking a job site that has MORE job adds listed, won`t mean that job site is better than one that has fewer jobs listed. What I`m suggesting is, looking at, comparing, recording data and presenting that as evidence of quality over quantity, but mix and match them too to get the best from the ones you feel (a) are easiest to navigate and (b) act like a jobseeker, THINK like a work coach! I take that line from an old saying in the betting industry which goes, "Bet like a PRO, think like a BOOKIE!"...meaning, make sure you don`t lose every bet you place by being naïve and study what`s in front of you.


End of the day, it depends what types of jobs people are looking for, but nearly all (but a few choice sites) will list easy to apply for jobs, temporary, part time and dare I say it, zero hours contracts/contracts generally. Try and find the ones that that do the same as FAJ and take some screen shots to show their layouts.
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DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”? 13 Jun 2018 17:21 #8642

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FAJ is far less intrusive than Jobmatch and knowing the actual FAJ choices and constraints help to make informed choices, including pragmatic ones.

3,344 Retail Jobs in Manchester
www.adzuna.co.uk/jobs/search?q=Retail&w=Manchester

266 Retail jobs in Manchester
findajob.dwp.gov.uk/search?q=Retail&w=Manchester
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DWP says: ‘Find A Job’ can be used with “cookies turned off”? 13 Jun 2018 19:01 #8647

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That's a very good example of matching like-with-like and no work coach could justify refusing Adzuna here over FAJ based on those numbers.
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