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TOPIC: So I signed off sick and it was a right mess

So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 08 Aug 2017 15:31 #3902

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Missed an appointment for the work programme yesteday and emailed them to day I was sick, got email back saying "I will put this information into your appointment and the decision makers will be in touch to confirm I'm sure, I will send you another appointment for next week today.
It used to be an easy process to ring in sick but now they make you fill in a form at job centre and mark you absense and send to decision makers etc.



So filled in jsa form claim for jobseeker's allowance when sick JSA28 for yesterday and for the next 13 days and handed it in personally as there doesn't seem to be a better way.


So jobcentre says at first I cannot be sick ahead of time and I have to provide a fit note, I said yes I can it is the same as a fit note and I know I am going to be sick etc and for the first 2 weeks I can fill in this form (it is the 13 weeks I would need a fit note for and I'm still deciding whether to go for this or not)
So job centre staff go away and ask and say they cannot give me my appointment or send the form off to Bolton until the 15th when my next appointment will be for signing (it is noted on the system though)
also cannot give me a next sign onappointment and I have to be available to talk to my advisor at 10 oclock on day of signing to arrange appointment for next sign (so talking to my advisor when off sick which kinda defeats the object of being sick) in and hope my money isn't delayed.

I think this system is terrible I had to go in with the form when I'm not well and no one seems to know what they are doing.

Going to take holiday afterwards but although I got the form they didn't know how long I can take or whether they stop your money ( I think they do until you get back).

Anyway kinda expecting this to go wrong and have no money next week...
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 08 Aug 2017 16:07 #3904

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Your right about the 14 day JSA28 so they should accept that without any fit note. The Work Programme also as they take their instruction from the job centre? So if they do send you another appointment within your 14 day sickness, they should be informed that you have this time out officially and should not send you a further attendance appointment at least until after the 14 days. Your allowed two x 14 days sickness leave on JSA but I think you have to let the first one lapse before doing the second one? I think as long as you leave a day between both, but hopefully someone will correct me on that as I`m not 100% up to date with any changes that might have been made.

What a faff regarding the signing day and they can`t process the JSA28 until then? I`ve never heard of that, but I only handed in two fit notes while appealing my ESA during the weeks it took for my hearing to come around, so I continued to sign on rather than claim ESA assessment rate. Fool ha I was! Wouldn`t be as quick to do that again....

And yes, correct again regarding fit notes being required for the 13 week ESA phase if you decide to do that.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 08 Aug 2017 17:14 #3905

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I did read that there has to be 8 weeks between the two 14 day periods, will wait and see not sure what I'm going to do yet. Think I could say they are harrassing me whilst sick when they ring me and put in a complaint but do I want to get noticed, best to blend in the background most of the time. Emailed the work programme and said I will be on hols after my sickness and don't know the dates yet, my end of year is December I think so it all starts again in January, so might as well use it to sort myself out. Decided to go the operation I have been dreading so will get this started, it will probably take months to sort out and about 3 months to recover from.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 08 Aug 2017 18:39 #3906

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There doesn`t seem to be clarity in the time between these 14 day sickness rules. I thought they could be taken continually with just one day between them, but that was discussed on the old UM forum as I recall, so hell knows what has changed since then.

Main thing is that you satisfy yourself of the current rules and read it back to them. B) If you are having planned surgery, you should also ask regarding the timeline on that as the two 14 day JSA sickness days wouldn`t benefit your recovery, so claiming ESA would be the way to go I feel. You would go the 13 day assessment phase, have an ESA assessment and then await their ruling. But given you would be having surgery and then post op recovery time, they would need to take those into account and depending on the outcome, how you were afterwards.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 08 Aug 2017 19:58 #3907

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I've been on ESA before but have stopped just before assessment as it is so stressful and thought I would get better. Main reason I haven't gone on it as I do not know my new doctors at all and specialists just say my back pain is chronic and have given up on treating it.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 09 Aug 2017 08:50 #3908

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Ah....your in much the same boat as me Sandella. GP`s and clinics not giving you any decent feedback or treatment or even a proper diagnosis, just dead ends. Been there and still am. Bloody sick of the whole system, medical and welfare combined. I have chronic pain yet always have to keep justifying my existence to these people because I feel as if I`m going through the same revolving door all the time with no end to it.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 09 Aug 2017 13:39 #3909

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got this email this morning, I think they are really stupid

I'm confused as to how you know you will be sick till the 22nd? Do you have a sick note from the doctor or a period of sickness note from JCP? If so would you be able to provide evidence etc etc then goes onto to threaten sanction etc However if none of the above evidence appears, appointments will be issued, if you fail to attend then I have no option but to follow our correct procedures, which I am sure you are aware of for a fail to attend appointment..................................


I forwarded it to her boss with a complaint saying it is worsening my mental health condition and is intimidation and she has no right to ask for my private medical data and no right to question whether I know my mind and body etc. She is manager and should be trained better.


sometimes this kind of thing gets me going in the morning, anger has a way of getting my out of depression, I've been feeling depressed since my thyroid meds were lowered.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 09 Aug 2017 14:01 #3910

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It is up to the Job centre to inform the work programme about the 13 wk, not sure about the 2 week but think I have done enough

What happens next (if you are on the Work Programme)
If you are on the Work Programme you
will need to tell your Work Programme
Provider and the Jobcent
re that you are sick.
The Jobcentre will contact you to discuss your sickness or health condition and
agree what you are able to do to look for work while you are sick.
The Jobcentre work coach will ask your
Work Programme Provider to contact
you to discuss your Action Plan and agree any actions you need to take while
you are sick.
If you do not do the things you have agreed
to do to look for work you may lose
your benefit.
You will need to send your fit note(s) to
the work coach in the Jobcentre. The
work coach will contact you before your fit note ends and will tell your Work
Programme Provider when you are no
longer sick. Your Work Programme
Provider will discuss your Action Plan with you and agree the actions you need to take
...
What happens next (if you
want to keep claiming JSA)
If you are sick and want to stay on JSA y
ou will need to talk to your work coach.
Your work coach will discuss your sick
ness or health condition and agree with
you what you are able to do to look for
work over the period you are sick. The
actions you agree will be recorded and your
work coach will keep in touch with
you while you are sick. If you do not do the things you have agreed to do to look
for work you may lose your benefit.
You will be given form JSA28. You should
complete the form and return the tear-
off slip to the Jobcentre. This form
will cover up to the first 14 days of your
sickness period. If you are likely to be
sick for more than two weeks you will need
to provide supporting medical evidence fr
om the eighth day of your sickness
period to the end of it. If you expected to
be better within two weeks but find you
are still sick you will need to provide supporting medical evidence as soon as
possible, and dated no later than day 15 of
your sickness period. You must send
your supporting medical evidence to y
our work coach as soon as you can.
If you have a fit note from your doctor and
it runs out before your sickness ends
you will need to arrange to see your
doctor again to get another fit note. You
must also tell the Jobcentre that you ar
e still sick and send them your fit note as
soon as you can.
"Half the world is composed of people who have something to say and can't, and the other half who have nothing to say and keep on saying it." - Robert Frost ...
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 09 Aug 2017 14:32 #3911

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The problem with all this is Sandella, they don`t seem to be giving you clear cut information. You are sick, so you have chosen to take the 14 day route and fill in the appropriate form. I don`t understand why they are asking, "how do you know you will be ill up until the 22nd?" What illness/excuse did you write on the JSA28 form? Maybe they have looked at that and decided you won`t be expected to be out of action for this long? Although two weeks is not an eternity in any estimation. Bloody cheek...

Is it the job centre or the work programme who have sent you this email? If it`s the work programme, I would tell them that you have officially SIGNED OFF SICK for date X to Z and this has been accepted by your job centre. If indeed that`s the case. If it`s the job centre sending you the email, then proceed by saying that you have taken this time off to fully recover and to see your GP or whoever you see generally. If you are experiencing anxiety/stress or mental unwellness, I would actually chat to your GP about it and ask for a note or a summary of our visits. Any medical evidence you can get is power to you. Just keep yourself right here and use ignorance where possible if they start to come down heavy. But don`t allow that. Use your knowledge and carry on.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 09 Aug 2017 14:34 #3912

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Sorry it was the work programme asking for a copy of jsa28 which has my private medical info on, job centre accepted the form ok.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 09 Aug 2017 16:09 #3913

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If you got a photocopy of it, you could redact (blank out) any personal information on it and give them that. As long as it has your name/address and date on it or a jobcentre stamp, that should be proof enough. Always keep copies of anything they give you. The job centre have not questioned anything and they have accepted your form, so the work programme, as usual, are trying it on. The answer to that is, keep your calm and give them static. Only provide them with anything the job centre have allowed to keep you in charge. They then cannot say attend on X date or dictate anything. You have told them that you have taken sick leave and handed in the appropriate forms to do so. They should not contact you again until after this date, or be told that you may well be taking a longer extended leave soon if you decide to have surgery. Just take this one first and if they do say they have sent any negative stuff to the job centre, they will have it on record that you are officially ill, so stuff them!
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 09 Aug 2017 16:29 #3914

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Thanks, I'm not going to engage again until I'm officially back on the rolls, centre manager is going to speak to her tomorrow, hoping they realise me being parked is a lot of less bother (I was parked). Going to take the week off and decide what to do, what really annoys me is what these advisors get away with when people don't stand up for themselves and their lack of training in benefit regs.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 10 Aug 2017 09:53 #3917

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I did several JSA28 during my time on the Work Programme and I told the Work Programme nothing. A JSA28 will protect you against any kind of sanctions from your WPP, so there is nothing they can do while you are ill. Your WPP is trying to pull some dirty trick. You can safely ignore them (which I did).
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 10 Aug 2017 11:11 #3918

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Well said Ducray. I find that when we take on board official ways of doing things, the job centre staff (in the main) do a good job and process paperwork or fax things correctly. Given that they are the overlords and not the work programme, they are the ones who dish out the rules, so as long as you have gone down the correct route and the job centre acknowledge it, the work programme have no authority. They think they do, but they don`t. That`s why they have to go through work coaches or higher authority to get anywhere. They have NO powers on their own.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 10 Aug 2017 22:59 #3929

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Ducray wrote:
I did several JSA28 during my time on the Work Programme and I told the Work Programme nothing. A JSA28 will protect you against any kind of sanctions from your WPP, so there is nothing they can do while you are ill. Your WPP is trying to pull some dirty trick. You can safely ignore them (which I did).
Exactly! I did the same but when I was on the dreaded CWP. Not once did I tell my CWP providers anything, I just sent off my JSA28 forms and there was nothing they could do about it. The provider did try to contact me a few times when I was off sick, I ignored them every time. Of course once my sickness period ended I was re-referred to the same providers but ultimately it resulted in me never having to do any unpaid forced work for those bastards.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 11 Aug 2017 13:38 #3937

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Sandella wrote:
got this email this morning, I think they are really stupid

.
Best to tell them to remove your email address and phone number from their systems then you wont receive any more stupid emails.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 14 Aug 2017 03:57 #3951

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"Half the world is composed of people who have something to say and can't, and the other half who have nothing to say and keep on saying it." - Robert Frost ...
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 22 Aug 2017 12:15 #4009

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Have got my 12 week fit note from the Doctor, going to send it in by post. I think I will go onto ESA after this for a few months or unless they cut me off, did an online test and it said I should be in the support group, doubt that works in real life though. So off until 14th November and then can take my 2 weeks holiday and new claim year starts 20th January. Hoping to have an operation soon.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 22 Aug 2017 14:35 #4010

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Well done Sandella. Remember to photocopy anything you send in or hand in as proof. You can hand in fit notes and the job centre copy and fax them if you want to save yourself any delays. Posting is fine, but sometimes things go missing. Keep notes of dates or times too just in case you forget anything. Keep a wee diary.
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So I signed off sick and it was a right mess 22 Aug 2017 16:53 #4011

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Will send it recorded and take a copy, thanks

I asked for 12 weeks as I wasn't sure if the two weeks I had already taken get taken off the 13 weeks sickness or not, so confusing, got a bit upset in the dr's office tbh.
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