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TOPIC: Work Programme End, Job Centre visits, to break me

Work Programme End, Job Centre visits, to break me 28 Apr 2018 10:48 #7220

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So my work programme has ended, haven't gone into the place for a maybe a year anyway, they never bothered to ask me in after my 12 weeks sickness. Anyway knew that they might ask me to come in everyday from experience but I live an hour or so away and travel would cost them alot of money and everyday visits with my health issues would not be possible.

Was talking to job coach not usual one and he said I will be required to visit the job centre everyday until they break me (there was me thinking it was their goal to help me into work haha), now I have disabilities. illnesses, so asking me to come in everyday would just lead me into ESA pretty quick. Wish I had this on tape actually, I stated that coming in everyday would make me very sick, just the travel alone and he said that my disabilities whilst on JSA would not be considered as I was expected to be able to work full time (which I'm not) think it was 16 hours from memory.

So haven't seen this advisor since, was quite shocked at the time and expect my next appointment to be the start of this process, so I want to be ready with a letter saying what I can or cannot do and the law behind it, any help appreciated. I can take 12 weeks sickness again as the new year has started but would rather start fighting.

I did used to see the disability advisor at the job centre but they were made redundant so just sent on work programme and parked when I would not fill in forms or comply etc.
"Half the world is composed of people who have something to say and can't, and the other half who have nothing to say and keep on saying it." - Robert Frost ...
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Work Programme End, Job Centre visits, to break me 28 Apr 2018 11:04 #7223

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Nice one Sandella :) ; although i hope you weren't too sick though.

I've always thought that this may put a spoke in the works for most of their stupid courses programmes as must put the whole thing right down the pan as the people doing the "training " are going to be either totally unqualified or failed teachers at best :angry: .

The travel aspect is also a good point Sandella and i bet they would have factored that in, or should i say some jobsworth would've done it for them.

"Was talking to job coach not usual one and he said I will be required to visit the job centre everyday until they break me (there was me thinking it was their goal to help me into work haha), now I have disabilities. illnesses, so asking me to come in everyday would just lead me into ESA pretty quick. "

Sandella i obviously dont know you personally or your overall situation but if some roach started that crap with me it would be in with a very strong formal complaint to jobcentre manager and regional manager and would literally go and see my MP,this is a form of harassment intimidation and an abuse of process. :evil: :angry: :angry: :evil: :angry: :angry:


ask for a meeting in a private room and get them to go through that little conversation again this time with a recording,thats you recording ,dont tell them.

I seriously would log a formal complaint but if you are feeling too stressed to do so i totally understand that.

I am looking forward to the day these muppets at joke central try that line on me :)

Sandella i will PM you sometime today or tomorrow regards to help. :)

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Work Programme End, Job Centre visits, to break me 28 Apr 2018 11:13 #7224

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Yes thanks, I do usually record every visit but this time couldn't find my lead, I did state I have a law degree and that I would fight this etc but as I didn't have the facts as to hours expected with health issues in front of me just wanted to leave, my mental capacity is on point and my issues are spine/tailbone nerve pain. I cannot sit for hardly any time or stand for long periods, each time I do it gets worse for the next day, so everyday visits would leave me unable to walk at all (this happened two months back and my neighbour had to help me) my back has just settled down again but still have assumed nerve damage in my foot, I am also waiting for another operation for a different issue. I do not look ill at all as if it is bad I stay indoors as worry I wouldn't get home.
"Half the world is composed of people who have something to say and can't, and the other half who have nothing to say and keep on saying it." - Robert Frost ...
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Work Programme End, Job Centre visits, to break me 28 Apr 2018 11:17 #7225

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Sent you a PM. :)

Ok Sandella a serious conversation with your dr is required with this, and also explain how the whole situation is having a negative impact on your mental health as i am presuming it is ?

Your dr will be able to supply on going fitnotes and to articulate to brickhead down at joke shop etc what it is you are suffering from physically and now mentally due to the unnecessary bullying harassment you have recently received.If you discuss any of this with joke shop or providers make sure that phone is set to record really good ;)

I note what you say of overall you look well as do i but medically speaking joke shop haven't a clue as they take everyone on face value all things fit all sizes.

They will only be remotely happy if someone had a limb amputation, and even then, those self righteous jobsworths would question that. :evil:


jobber
Take action under the Protection from Harassment Act 1997


When is something harassment under the Act?
Generally speaking harassment is behaviour which causes you distress or alarm.

The Act also says you must have experienced at least two incidents by the same person or group of people for it to be harassment.
Get them to have that conversation again or anything similar Sandella or have you any other recordings of similar conversations ?


It's the courts that decide if something is harassment under the Act. The courts will look at whether most people or a reasonable person would think the behaviour amounts to harassment.

You could defend yourself giving the joke shop roach a copy of the act for their safe keeping ;) :)

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Work Programme End, Job Centre visits, to break me 28 Apr 2018 11:40 #7226

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Hi Sandella, hope you are keeping okay mentally having been spoken to as if you had no issues at all by this prat.

You wrote:
my issues are spine/tailbone nerve pain. I cannot sit for hardly any time or stand for long periods, each time I do it gets worse for the next day, so everyday visits would leave me unable to walk at all (this happened two months back and my neighbour had to help me)

Right, you begin by making an appointment with your GP (and one you know will listen and not preach the `work is good for you speech) and obtain as much medical information about the above problems. Ask the GP for past medical print outs of anything from medications, x-rays, scans, meetings with other consultants etc....and explain that you are being placed under constant pressure to do things you simply can`t and that alone could lead to DWP sanctions. Your GP should then help you with limiting what you can`t achieve by saying so on a fit note or a letter that you can then apply to any claimant commitment they ask you to sign.

Also ask your GP to record these on a `fit note` or other written form saying that the problem(s) you have severely limit your ability to do things. You say you cannot sit or stand for long periods? This alone would give you an ESA descriptor for not meeting this and could score you enough points in the:Sitting & Standing and Mobility areas. You need 15 points to be awarded ESA, so just scoring on those alone could win you an ESA award based around sitting, standing, how far you can `mobilise` without discomfort, safely, reliably and repeatedly. They would expect you to be able to mobilise using a manual wheelchair in a work place, so think about whether using one could be difficult if you cannot propel a wheelchair using your back or upper body. They tried that one on me not linking the fact that I suffer from NECK/nerve pain that radiates into my head and eye if I use my arms or shoulders. So they were stuffed on that one.

I was awarded ESA on two separate descriptors and those came under the mobilising/sitting & standing descriptors. I would also meet one of the other descriptors but wasn`t awarded points on it because I`d already achieved the 15 points on the other two.

Have you ever considered speaking to a CAB advisor about ESA? If you havn`t, I think you should take a look at the ESA50 form and the sections within it and see where you mught meet some of them.

jobber will give you some insight into dealing with coach and info on signing on and having health problems.
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Work Programme End, Job Centre visits, to break me 28 Apr 2018 12:00 #7227

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It might be time to think of this, physio appointment has just been put back until July 15th and have that before my operation, so a long wait. As for a wheel chair, I cannot sit down unless they literally paralysed my lower body as it is too painful, so wheelchair is not an option, as for standing can stand longer but eventually will not be put weight on one leg and it will be much worse the next day. I thought the dr's charged for all that information tbh so never requested it. My doctor's just closed and moved all the patients over to a new surgery, but they do have my records at least.
"Half the world is composed of people who have something to say and can't, and the other half who have nothing to say and keep on saying it." - Robert Frost ...
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Work Programme End, Job Centre visits, to break me 28 Apr 2018 18:33 #7231

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I also only go out when I am up to it and apparently look generally okay (one cretin at Remploy who hounded me on the phone for weeks said "You don't look like you have a got a mental illness"). More periodical in my case as fatigue is my main issue but I learned after repeated experiences not to take unnecessary risks and keep stocked up with basics. I have recurring problem in my lumber region from an old football injury and I know how restrictive that can be so really I just think people in your situation should be automatically put on ESA directly by a GP and supported into voluntary work if YOU are feeling up to it. There really are not many jobs around and that is what makes this whole draconian approach so ruddy well pointless.

One missed appt and you would think we had stolen the crown jewels. I have tackled them on this expectation we can all just go out any time or totally ignoring the situation in some cases and it all seems to fall on deaf ears even if I detail how it affects me on an ESA form which do not seem to address this problem directly. So am grateful to Jobber for how he has set all that out as my next ESA review is up in around 8 months by which time that benefit might not even exist anymore anyway. Whatever benefit is in place we do not just stop having illnesses and the fight will continue.

I do think this period of uncertainty and chaos that is brewing with UC is going to affect the benefits system itself adversely and not just the claimants. The benefits system is not fit for purpose and that is not just going to magically change overnight through their latest mickey mouse policy. I have known of a guy who had a skiing accident and was in a hospital bed only able to turn his head a few inches and he was passed fit for work, they can't get any tougher or stupid than that can they? If that was me and they found me a job, I'd have a field day with the media at their expense. They really are setting themselves up for a huge fall but sadly in the meantime we have to bare the pain.

The govt talk of understanding and listening to the mentally ill and physically disabled but they themselves are totally insane and incapable of doing any other job other than advisory roles set up by their mates! I cannot imagine going to the joke centre every day even though mine is easy to get to on a good day which it wasn't the last two times it snowed because they don't even grit our lane for over 10 years now. They need to be made to describe how we are supposed to manage this.

I do realise the implications on JSA as I was on it but on my commitment it was acknowledged that I had to limit job search to part time jobs due to my problems. I guess things change and I will be checking this part out on my next appt. It might be worth chatting with your JC manager first because the roach might be being deliberately unhelpful. If they laid their DEA off that's their decision, again though this doesn't mean that there are no longer people who need a DEA. Listening, really? If they keep sticking the boot in I agree that we are heading into complaints territory and don't forget to mention the added stress those long drawn out processes have on you.
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Work Programme End, Job Centre visits, to break me 29 Apr 2018 09:14 #7233

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Verc wrote:
I just think people in your situation should be automatically put on ESA directly by a GP and supported into voluntary work if YOU are feeling up to it.

Totally agree with this Verc but we know that won`t happen unless drastic changes are made to this whole circus of hate against claimants who are ill and continue to be assessed by paid monkeys.

Sandella saked: I thought the dr's charged for all that information tbh so never requested it.

Some GP`s will charge anywhere between £5/25 for a good letter, but asking for copies of stuff like appointments, referrals, medication list, proof of hospital visits/physio appointments and forth-coming surgery should all be given free. Accessing full medical records is, I believe,£50. Ridiculous when it`s OUR records!

You tell the GP that you see that you are in a no win situation with DWP and you require evidence of all this for either changes to be made to a Claimant Commitment together with a fit note stating why, or for claiming ESA. I would say claiming ESA sounds likely Sandella as you have a `disabling` condition that is not being taken seriously. You can`t allow them to dig you further into a pit. I`m in the process of gathering some new stuff together for my own ESA assessment which is due this year, although when I`m not sure. I see a physio this week but whether it will be a wasted journey, time will tell.
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